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Swedish m/1845-ish musket? (Muzzleloading)

by Fabian23 ⌂, Switzerland, Sunday, September 30, 2018, 22:25 (76 days ago)

I'm back into a few Scandinavian (well only Swedish) gunsand I come to you in the hope of solving a mystery. I received a Swedish musket in a deal together with an 1851 Kammerlader and I'm having trouble identifying it. It looks generally like a m/1845 percussion musket but several things are strange.

The barrel is Husqvarna made and is proofed and numbered to the stock (17) and fits very well. The inside is mirror smooth. The stock, barrel and lock screws and tang screw all have the assembly numerals VI stamped into them.

All the brass fittings are well made but of very thin brass. In comparison, the fittings on my m/1815 musket are much thicker. The bands fit perfectly but the muzzle band does not fit very well. From pictures online, it seems the trigger guard tang should also have finger ridges.

The lock fits tightly in its recess but it has no markings. Strangely on the inside there is no bridle covering the tumbler although the stock recess is clearly cut for a lock having one.

The hammer is not checkered and the hammer screw is very crudely made.

The shaped of the dog catch is incorrect as far as I could make out.

I would be very interested to know what this musket is. An unfinished musket sold out of the back of Husky in the 1840s? A film prop?

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Thank you in advance for any help you can provide.

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by jæger justnæs @, Kristiansand, Sunday, September 30, 2018, 23:05 (76 days ago) @ Fabian23

Nice musket, Fabian23.
Browsing Josef Alm's book there are two main candidates - the M1840 and M1845. There is also an M1845 for cadets. Sligthly smaller/more slender version of the previous mentioned (124,5 cm overall length, 3 Kg weight, 16mm bore). Do you have any measures at hand?

PS! The tumbler looks a bit crudely made, the mainspring almost slipping off. A replacement part made by the local blacksmith and there was no room for the bridle? Or perhaps the bridle broke as well as the old tumbler?

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by Fabian23 ⌂, Switzerland, Sunday, September 30, 2018, 23:40 (76 days ago) @ jæger justnæs

Hi, thanks for your help so far!

It is a full sized musket, OAL is 145.5cm and the bore is 18.5mm. The lock has definitely been worked on. The tumbler doesn’t even have an axis which would normally be supported in the bridle and there is just a peg limiting its rotation.

P.S Since you have Alm’s book, I’ll have a question for you on the m/1815 musket.

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by jæger justnæs @, Kristiansand, Monday, October 01, 2018, 09:34 (75 days ago) @ Fabian23

Ok, I think we can conclude on that it is a M1840-45-ish with some faults and rather crude repairs. Maybe the lumps behind the trigger had been removed, or would a M1815-family guard fit as a replacement? Front band looks a bit home made.

Low serial number seems to fit on these models. Here's a link to the Swedish digital museum including a search for gevär m/1845. We have the same in Norway. Just change from .se to .no. Handy to have when browsing different models. Mind you, not very detailed information and often one or two pictures.

Hope this was helpful.
What can I help with concerning that M1815?

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by Fabian23 ⌂, Switzerland, Monday, October 01, 2018, 11:57 (75 days ago) @ jæger justnæs

Thanks! It does indeed seem to fit. I also notice the sling swivel is mounted like on the 1815 straight through the stock and middle band.

Since the stock, barrel and fittings are so good, I’d really like to restore the lock. I guess I’ll need to start looking for old sporterised or chopped up muskets.

If I trim back the front of the stock about 5mm, the muzzle band should fit perfectly. The trigger guard shows no sign of ever having grooves, the surface and patina is completely smooth.

My question about the 1815 musket is whether the book has any information on the self-priming design. I know how it works but I’d really like a diagram or schematic of the shape of the breech and flash hole. I’ll be doing a short tutorial on how to make Swedish style musket cartridges and I would like to talk about the feature.

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by jæger justnæs @, Kristiansand, Monday, October 01, 2018, 18:08 (75 days ago) @ Fabian23

It might be that your musket is also made from odd bits and pieces gathered by an eager collector. I am confident it will get better with a bit of your care.

When it comes to the self-priming vent hole we have something similar on Danish/Norwegian muskets. I cannot remember having seen a contemporary illustration of it.
Alm refers to it being 7mm on the inside, 3mm outside diameter. No illustrations as far as I can see. I am not familiar with which models had it but some of the Dk/N models used Kyhl's pan screen to hinder injuries to the fellow standing on the right side in the firing line. Example picture borrowed from Trond's page.

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by Fabian23 ⌂, Switzerland, Monday, October 01, 2018, 22:33 (75 days ago) @ jæger justnæs

Ok, just knowing the cone profile is enough to do a sketch.

Going back to the mystery musket, I had the m/1815 musket out to compare side by side. The brass bands are actually the same thickness, it’s just that they are longer on the 1815 so feel heavier. The muzzle band has been made in the same way so I believe it is an original part. The trigger guards are not the same profile, the loop is more rounded and the tang is slightly shorter on the mystery musket. The butt plate is also incompatible. The top tang of the 1815 is much longer and complicated.

I think that all I need to do to restore it is find a donor lock.

Does Alm’s book have information on the load for the 1851 Kammerlader?

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by jæger justnæs @, Kristiansand, Monday, October 01, 2018, 23:33 (75 days ago) @ Fabian23

Sorry, the Alm book I have is almost completely focused on army issue weapons. Title loosely translates to 'Army handheld firerarms then and now'. The M1851 is briefly mentioned but no details.
Luckily, there is a lot of information on the forum. I think this might be useful for you.

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by Fabian23 ⌂, Switzerland, Monday, October 01, 2018, 23:38 (75 days ago) @ jæger justnæs

Perfect thanks!

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by jæger justnæs @, Kristiansand, Tuesday, October 02, 2018, 10:21 (74 days ago) @ Fabian23

Glad I could be of assistance.
I wish you the best of luck upon restoring the M1845-ish and on the paper cartridge tutorial. Please share link when it is done.

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Swedish m/1845-ish musket?

by Øyvind F. ⌂ @, Bergen, Monday, November 05, 2018, 22:50 (40 days ago) @ jæger justnæs

I came across an M-1815-38 breech plug during a cleanup.

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